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A couple of days ago, I flew with a popular budget airline within Europe. The aircraft was an A320. It was also a brand new one (only in service since June 2018 and produces 15% less noise and fuel emissions than previous models, or so they told us).

Anyway, onto the question. During the flight, I asked a member of CC if I could meet the pilots after landing, they asked for me and the pilots agreed. They seemed happy to have a chat, I asked them how much hand-flying they had done on the 3 hour flight we had just completed (after reading on here the average for this type is 3 - 7 minutes per flight). The captain sheepishly grinned and pointed at the FO...I turned around and he was laughing. The captain then told me that since the weather was so nice, the FO, who was still fairly new, asked if he could take control. Turns out he ended up hand-flying most of the cruise!

The captain then assured me that pilots don't use passenger flights to 'practice' their skills however, and that it was actually permitted and encouraged by this airline.

I thoroughly enjoyed the 'insider' knowledge of that flight and didn't mind one bit whether the pilots chose to use auto-pilot or not, but my question is - was this actually permitted? I have read, on this site, that the A320 has specific instructions in the manual that pilots must engage auto-pilot after 10,000 ft until approach.

Cloud
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    I suppose you don't want to divulge the actual flight you were on to protect the pilot, but you can check on flightradar24 or flightaware yourself how much time was actually spent level at cruise altitude. For short European flights this can be a matter of minutes. Most of the flight is then climbing or descending which means that the rationale for using the autopilot (namely, tight tolerances on altitude for separation) doesn't hold. I don't know about the regs though. – Sanchises Sep 13 '18 at 10:50
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    note that "instructions in the manual" != "regulations" – Federico Sep 13 '18 at 10:57
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    There is no mandate in the generic A320 manual to fly on autopilot above 10000ft. Individual airlines‘ manuals may add this restriction though. – Cpt Reynolds Sep 13 '18 at 12:49
  • @Sanchises Exactly, it's why I avoid mentioning the airline, though I'm sure it is pretty obvious. Anyway, the flight was 3 hours, so I think we probably spent at least 2 hours at cruise? – Cloud Sep 13 '18 at 13:08
  • @Sanchises I just checked and we spent a little over an hour at 37,000 – Cloud Sep 13 '18 at 13:17
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    There could also be some exaggeration/variation in the phrase "most of the cruise". – FreeMan Sep 13 '18 at 15:03
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    Related: When might a pilot hand-fly a jet at cruise altitudes, and is it difficult? –  Sep 14 '18 at 11:06
  • Aren't pilots required to hand-fly a flight every so often to keep them from forgetting how to do it? – Vikki Feb 28 '19 at 04:21

2 Answers2

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I think they were humouring you Cloud. Hand flying a jet at level cruise speed is not fun. It takes a lot of concentration and the novelty quickly wears off, and there is a high risk of getting busted for an altitude deviation due to a little bit of inattention. Even if you are able to find a sweet spot with the trim where it holds altitude perfectly with no stick pressure, making you think you can relax a bit, all it takes is a temperature change or running into a bit of mountain wave and airplane will climb or descend and if you are distracted.. and drift up or down a couple hundred feet... busted. RVSM legalities aside, I can't believe even a bushy tailed FO would hand fly more than a few minutes in cruise.

Plus with AP on, just one pilot has to be monitoring the AP, and the other one can do paperwork, sleep, do handstands, play video games or whatever. When hand flying, the pilot not flying has to be monitoring the pilot flying. For an entire hour plus? No way. Just too much work and risk to your livelihood.

John K
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    I second this wholeheartedly. – Cpt Reynolds Sep 13 '18 at 21:30
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    But on the other hand, FO was still 'new'; and secondly, this was A320, which does 'trim perfectly'. So I presume most of the time it would still be 'hands off' flying. – Zeus Sep 14 '18 at 01:07
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    Airplanes trim to a speed, not to a vertical level. The 320 is no different. This won't prevent an altitude deviation from something like wave or a temperature change that increases or decreases thrust. – John K Sep 14 '18 at 01:29
  • I'm very tempted to post a link to the video of the conversation, but I would hate for such friendly and accommodating pilots to get into any trouble because of it. When you say 'busted'... do you mean that ATC would ask what is going on if they saw more than 200ft deviation? Or something more serious? – Cloud Sep 14 '18 at 09:04
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    @Cloud are you saying that you filmed them? did you ask for their consent? – Federico Sep 14 '18 at 10:40
  • @Federico My friend who was with me did. We didn't ask, but they could see him stood their with camera / smartphone pointing and didn't object. – Cloud Sep 14 '18 at 11:00
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    @Cloud That's even more evidence that what they did wasn't against any regulations. No person would willingly give away information that could end their career while knowingly being filmed... especially in just a short conversation with a passenger. – SnakeDoc Sep 14 '18 at 15:36
  • Really nice to know. Good answer! – Peter Feb 26 '19 at 23:31
  • @john k the Airbus doesn't trim for speed at all, it trims for attitude, ie the relation between the nose and the horizon. – PilotDan Feb 27 '19 at 01:57
  • @PilotDan So if you pull the thrust to idle without touching trim, it holds the existing attitude and slows down? That is very odd behaviour to program into a FBW system. The C-Series/A220 has a state of the art FBW, but it still trims to a speed. There is even a trim speed bug on the speed tape to make it easy to set the trim speed you want without having to blip and blip to find the sweet spot when you are on-speed. – John K Feb 27 '19 at 02:50
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    I respectfully disagree with your opinion that" Hand flying a jet at level cruise speed is not fun." I agree that "It takes a lot of concentration", but for me "novelty quickly wears off" was not at all true. These things are, of course, a matter of opinion, and I admit I was an outlier among the pilot population of the carriers I flew for. – Terry Feb 27 '19 at 03:28
  • @JohnK, the thing with A320 is that it auto-trims for wing loading. If you pull thrust to idle, it will indeed maintain flight path—which means altitude if it was flying level—and pitch up as it slows down. It will descend slightly as the system has some response delay, but much less than types with manual trim. – Jan Hudec Feb 27 '19 at 06:45
  • @JanHudec it sounds like you are describing ALT hold mode with A/P on. If A/P is off, and you go to idle and just sit and watch it, what happens? It pitches up to maintain altitude or attitude until it slows to stall? It pitches over at some point? Autothrottles intervene? – John K Feb 27 '19 at 14:23
  • @JohnK, no, I am describing Normal Flight Law. Nothing to do with A/P, always on. With A/P off if you go idle and just sit an watch it, it will start pitching up to maintain straight flight path, descending a bit due to the lag in control response, until it hits the 12.8° AoA, at which point it will start pitching down to maintain that 12.8° AoA by pitch. At this point, nothing will touch the engine power, but if you pulled on the stick and commanded more than 14° AoA, the engines would accelerate to TO/GA and stay there until you moved the thrust levers to TO/GA and then back. – Jan Hudec Feb 27 '19 at 19:22
  • Ok thanks. I have read in the past that a lot of pilots were unhappy with the Airbus FBW model, and that Boeing's FBW model is a little more "pilot centric" and mimics natural aircraft behaviour a little more. I was told once that the C Series/A220 control law kind of splits the difference. – John K Feb 27 '19 at 19:42
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Since the flight was in Europe and you are specifically referring to the cruise flight, it is very likely that the flight was operated in Reduced Vertical Separation Minima (RVSM) airspace. All airspace in Europe between FL290 and FL410 is RVSM airspace.

To be approved to fly in RVSM airspace there are several regulations. Some of them are regulations related to the aircraft equipment, others are related to maintenance or the way to aircraft is operated.

The equipment requirements state that in RVSM airspace, the aircraft's must have an automatic altitude control system; (see SPA.RVSM.110PDF). But this doesn't tell us that the automatic control system must be used; for that we need to look at the operator approval.

The operator approval is not a public document; it is tailored specifically to the situation of the operator. However, there are Acceptable Means of Compliance (AMC) defined for special approvals that give the guidance or boilerplate text for RVSM approvals.

The European Aviation Safety Authority has published these AMCPDF for all specific approvals. The RVSM section starts on page 24 of the document.

Under AMC2 SPA.RVSM.105 RVSM operational approval:

OPERATING PROCEDURES

...

d. In-flight procedures

  1. The following practices should be incorporated into flight crew training and procedures:

...

(iv) When changing levels, the aircraft should not be allowed to overshoot or undershoot the cleared flight level by more than 45 m (150 ft). If installed, the level off should be accomplished using the altitude capture feature of the automatic altitude-control system.

(v) An automatic altitude-control system should be operative and engaged during level cruise, except when circumstances such as the need to re-trim the aircraft or turbulence require disengagement. In any event, adherence to cruise altitude should be done by reference to one of the two primary altimeters. Following loss of the automatic height-keeping function, any consequential restrictions will need to be observed.

(vi) Ensure that the altitude-alerting system is operative.

Therefore you can conclude that if the cruise flight was fully hand flown, and within RVSM airspace (between FL290 and FL 410), it was in violation of the Operator RVSM Approval, and therefor in violation of the regulations.

Community
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DeltaLima
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    Comments are not for extended discussion; this conversation has been moved to chat. – Federico Sep 14 '18 at 06:19
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    Thanks. „Should be operative and engaged“, is not strict, right? Should isn’t a shall or must. PS: Both answers are enlightening :) – Peter Feb 26 '19 at 23:28
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    All that this answer boils down to is, if the crew's statement was correct about hand flying, then they were probably at or below FL 280. This answer really doesn't address the stated question; it just explains a particular parameter that would have to be met. – Ralph J Feb 26 '19 at 23:44