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From what I have seen on grammar specialized websites das and dies are not declined when they are used as subjects in combination with sein. Example: Dies sind Zeitungen.

Apart from this, are there any other instances where das/dies can't be declined?

For example when the object of the action is a masculine noun and we wish to replace it with das/dies:

Ich habe einen Hammer gefunden.

With das/dies:

=》Ich habe das/dies in der Garage gefunden.

or

=》Ich habe den/diesen in der Garage gefunden.

Are diesen/den in accordance with the grammar rules here? Do you think das/dies would fit better?

Edit: I would much apreciate some other examples of sentences in which the pronouns das and dies are not declined and don't act as subjects, if there are any.

Rare
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    Does this answer your question? In Exodus 1:1 of the Lutherbibel, why Dies instead of Diese? – mach Apr 19 '20 at 13:06
  • This is a duplicate, even though this is obscured by unclear wording. What the author apparently intends to ask for is the lack of [agreement](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Agreement(linguistics))_ of words like «dies» and «das». This can be seen in the comments to my answer where I have explained that there is nothing unusual about these words with regard to declension. – mach Apr 19 '20 at 13:10
  • @mach It is unusual that -es is optional, is it not? Er hat dies(es) vergessen, but only er hat jenes, sein(e)s vergessen. – David Vogt Apr 19 '20 at 15:04
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    Relevant: https://german.stackexchange.com/questions/5783/dies-oder-dieses https://german.stackexchange.com/questions/44627/difference-between-dieses-und-dies-in-accusative https://german.stackexchange.com/questions/44852/dies-before-a-noun https://german.stackexchange.com/questions/54883/in-welchem-kontext-wird-das-wort-dies-benutzt – David Vogt Apr 19 '20 at 16:16
  • @mach No. I want to hear a native's opinion on this. – Rare Apr 19 '20 at 17:03
  • @David Vogt These are very good explanations. Although some are written in german, I manage to understand the logic behind them. Thanks. – Rare Apr 19 '20 at 17:21
  • @DavidVogt: The reason why I have not mentioned «dieses» is that it would be very unusual in the deictic use, which was the only one this question in its original form referred to. Now that it has been heavily reworded, an answer needs to explain the difference between anaphoric and deictic use – which has already been done in: https://german.stackexchange.com/questions/54883/in-welchem-kontext-wird-das-wort-dies-benutzt (Unfortunately, I cannot change my close vote after the question has been reworded.) – mach Apr 19 '20 at 21:12
  • @Rare: Of course I am a native German speaker – why else would I have thought that the translation of «Kongruenz» into English would be “congruence” when it is really “agreement”? – mach Apr 19 '20 at 21:14
  • Sorry for assuming that. I thought my question was clear enough. – Rare Apr 25 '20 at 20:01

3 Answers3

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The words das or dies are declined regularly. There are no rules that restrict their declension.

The subject of a sentence is almost always in the nominative case (exceptions are extremely rare). So when the words das/dies function as the subject of a sentence, they will take their nominative declension form. When they are used in other grammatical functions that have other cases, they will take other declension forms in the appropriate case.

Being neutrum pronouns, the accusative form of dies/das is the same as the nominative form:

  • Nominative/accusative: dies/das
  • Genitive: dieses (rare)/dessen
  • Dative: diesem/dem

Examples with dative:

Ich kann diesem/dem nicht zustimmen.

Von diesem/dem halte ich gar nichts.

Examples with genitive (note that a pronominal use of the genitive dieses would be extremely unlikely and confusing because it sounds the same as nominative dieses):

Dessen Einfluss nimmt zu.

Ich entsinne mich dessen.

What happens with the case you have given as an example is that it does not use neutrum das or dies at all, but masculine der or dieser instead:

Ich habe diesen/den in der Garage gefunden.

This can be shown by transforming the sentence into the passive voice:

Dieser/der ist in der Garage gefunden worden.

With neutrum dies/das, the sentence would be as follows:

Ich habe dies/das in der Garage gefunden.

mach
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  • Intense. But wasn't the question about rules that restrict declension, if they exist ? –  Apr 18 '20 at 13:27
  • @a_donda: As I had said in the first sentence, they are declined regularly. But I will take your advice and try to make this more obvious still. – mach Apr 18 '20 at 14:26
  • Ok(+1), that would mean that the question is based on a wrong assumption ? It felt like it wouldn't answer that ... but I may as well be wrong. –  Apr 18 '20 at 14:35
  • @a_donda What do you mean by "It felt like it wouldn't answer that"?? – Nico Apr 18 '20 at 14:45
  • It does not answer "are there any rules that restrict the declension of pronouns" –  Apr 18 '20 at 15:02
  • Right, you mean "I had the impression that..". Sorry for asking, but I have got big problems with literal tranlations that don't make any sense... – Nico Apr 18 '20 at 15:15
  • "So when the words das/dies function as the subject of a sentence, they will take their nominative declension form. "
    Except these pronouns can't be declined at all when they function as subjects. Take for example the sentence These are newspapers. If we were to replace the subject with a demonstrative we would say Das/Dies sind Zeitungen.     – Rare Apr 18 '20 at 19:39
  • @Rare: Now I see what you mean. The question you really wanted to ask is why there is no congruence in number between dies/das and the predicative expression (the word es behaves the same, BTW). I’d invite you to reformulate your question, but it is a duplicate and has been answered several times already. – mach Apr 18 '20 at 21:56
  • @mach You are assumption is incorrect. I wanted to know if there are other cases where das/dies doesn't decline by gender, number and case. I guess I could have worded it differently. But – Rare Apr 19 '20 at 00:16
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This question cannot be answered without an available context. If you went into your garage and found something surprising such as a pistol, for example, you would show the item to someone and say "ich habe das in der Garage gefunden!". In contrast, if someone asked you to look for a pistol in your garage, you would show the item and say "ich habe diese (feminine) gefunden" because the feminine word "Pistole" constitutes common background for speaker and hearer.

Nico
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im a native german and here is my answer: Actually, most germans dont know the difference themselves, so the answer really is that you (when talking normally) almost never say "dies", but im not shure however, how much of a formal german you learn

Lukas
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  • Welcome to German SE. Unfortunately I'm not convinced, that an answer is helpful, which I would paraphrase as: Since few people know the difference, it does not matter. I suggest to either improve the answer by enriching it with some hard facts or delete it by yourself. – guidot Nov 21 '23 at 20:50