I was wondering, how do theoretical physicist arrive to such fundamental things like Lagrangians or actions. For example, the QED, action is given by: $$ \mathcal S_{QED} = \int_{\mathcal M} {\mathrm d^4x \; \left \{ -\frac{1}{4}F^{\mu \nu} F_{\mu \nu} + \bar{\psi} \left(i\gamma^\mu D_\mu - m \right)\psi \right \} } $$ Applying Euler-Lagrange equations for $\psi$ and $A_\mu$ we get the following: $$ (i\gamma^\mu \partial_\mu - m)\psi=e \gamma^\mu A_\mu \psi \\ \partial_\mu F^{\mu\nu} = ej^\nu $$ But I assume they just go the other way around, from the equations of motion to the actions, how do they do it?. If not, what other procedure do they follow?
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2It starts with the results of experiments and observations. Those are the foundations. Physics is not math. – John Doty Jul 17 '22 at 23:00
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Yes. But I mean, Maxwell arrived to its equations from experiment, but this made, for example, special relativity (or gave a hint to it) possible or telecomunications. Or for example Dirac with his equation. So I mean, the moment you have the equations (from experiments) how you arrive to the Lagrangian formulation. – Álvaro Rodrigo Jul 17 '22 at 23:15
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1Feynman said given the behavior, find the rules. Given the rules, predict the behavior. He meant given the outcome of experiments, find laws that match that outcome. Given a law of physics, predict outcomes of experiments that have not been done. Do those experiments and see if the law is right. – mmesser314 Jul 17 '22 at 23:15
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3This question is a bit broad. There is no procedure that physicists follow. Faraday was not well trained in math. He came up with the picture of lines of force. Dirac was a very good mathematician. He played with equations. – mmesser314 Jul 17 '22 at 23:18
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How does one find the anti-derivative of a new function? I would look for similarities with old functions, check a bunch of tables and experiment with different ways of writing it until I either guess the answer or give up. The procedure is much the same for finding the Lagrangian of a new differential equation. We get a useful tool for physics when it works, but we shouldn't be too reliant on that. – Connor Behan Jul 17 '22 at 23:49
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1The Character of Physical Law, Richard Feynman (1967), is a detailed book-length answer to this question. – g s Jul 18 '22 at 01:36
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1Possible duplicates: https://physics.stackexchange.com/q/695094/2451 and links therein. – Qmechanic Jul 18 '22 at 03:42
1 Answers
There's been a lot of back-and-forth in the past few centuries in the way physics laws are written. Sometimes laws that were fundamental became mere consequences of deeper ones. Sometimes there were laws that were equivalent, but one version was more suited for newer topics.
Maxwell's equations have the very special property of having remained unchanged with progress in physics. Sure, they have been rewritten with new tools, the mathematical nature of the terms inside them have evolved, but their overall form didn't change.
It was already known before quantum physics that Maxwell's equations could be derived in a relativistic setting by using the variational reasoning that was already successful for mechanics. My history lessons are a bit vague now, but Lorentz boosts were already known by the end of the 19th century, so Lorentz group was available, and some work on gauge invariance was already on the way, using Maxwell's equations as a starting point.
Things moved in the 30s when Wigner brought the idea of a generalized use of group theory. Take the symmetry groups that were used in a classical setting, keep them as you move to a quantum setting, but change the algebra (roughly speaking, move to another space for the representation of the same group). That's how you get equations that have the same structure as the old Maxwell's equations, but with fields that have a different mathematical nature (live in another space).
Since a similar process was working well for another parts of physics, it was decided to keep the process, to elevate it to a very fundamental status. This effectively reversed the roles, as Maxwell's equations ceased to be fundamental and joined Newton's laws (for example) as derived laws.
Careful, however, not to over-interpret this. There's no single physical law from which all others derive. This is only a mathematical procedure, based on group theory, that can build theories "on demand": you input a set of symmetry groups and specify the algebra, and you get a theory as output. Some of those theories make no sense or collapse by themselves, but Poincaré group+gauge group $U(1)$ will give you Maxwell's equations, in classical or quantum form, depending on the algebraic context.
So yes, Maxwell's equations came first historically. But if you forget history and see things just from a formal point of view, we have built enough trust in the symmetry group approach to consider the lagrangian / action building process to be more fundamental.
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