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The principle of relativity says that all observers see the same laws of physics. It is, to my knowledge, the underlying principle behind General Relativity; put alternatively, General Relativity is what results when one requires the principle of relativity to work for all observers (not just inertial ones).

If this view is correct, does this imply that quantum mechanics does not obey the principle of relativity (since QM is incompatible with GR)?

If the answer is "yes", does that imply that QM itself is not well-defined, since different observers observe different physical laws? Put alternatively, does this imply that QM predicts the existence of a "luminiferous aether"? If the answer is "no", in what sense is QM incompatible with GR?

Edit: to clarify, I'm most interested in whether quantum mechanics obeys/violates the principle of relativity. Some kind of explicit example would be ideal.

Allure
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    QFT (e.g. the standard model) is constructed to be compatible with special relativity. There are several posts here which discuss the problems of GR with QFT/QM. What exactly this incompatibility "means" is open research. – Tobias Fünke Mar 11 '24 at 08:36
  • Related: https://physics.stackexchange.com/q/387/2451 and links therein. – Qmechanic Mar 11 '24 at 08:52
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    You need to define what you mean by quantum mechanics, and you need to clarify whether by relativity you mean special relativity or general relativity. The Schrodinger equation is not compatible with any form of relativity while QFT is compatible with special relativity. If you are specifically asking about GR then the issue is more complicated as full compatibility would require quantising gravity as well. – John Rennie Mar 11 '24 at 10:49
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    @JohnRennie I don't understand. The question asks about the Principle of Relativity, not GR or SR (although presumably both GR and SR obey it). – Allure Mar 11 '24 at 11:48
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    @Allure SR requires only that QM be Lorentz covariant while GR requires that it be generally covariant. – John Rennie Mar 11 '24 at 11:52
  • @Allure But in the question body you explicitly talk about GR... – Tobias Fünke Mar 11 '24 at 13:20
  • @JohnRennie Even in relativistic QFT, the time evolution of the state is governed by the Schrödinger equation (or the "usual" equivalent Heisenberg picture). – Tobias Fünke Mar 11 '24 at 13:21
  • @TobiasFünke yes but I'm under the impression that GR respects the principle of relativity, in fact GR was inspired by it. (I'm also under the impression the principle of relativity is independent of SR/GR.) Does QM also respect the principle? If no, does that imply the laws of physics vary between reference frames? – Allure Mar 11 '24 at 14:33
  • @JohnRennie I don't understand your comment. Can you elaborate? – Allure Mar 11 '24 at 14:34
  • QM is incompatible with GR. This is a false assumption. String theory, regardless of whether it turns out to be right or wrong, proves that they are compatible. – Ghoster Mar 11 '24 at 17:01

7 Answers7

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For Quantum mechanics and quantum field theory (QFT) space-time is just a background, on which the interaction play of quantum fields and quantum particles takes place. In QFT special relativity is implemented, so it takes into account different observers perspectives as long as they are made from initial systems.
Once one deals the general relativity, space-time itself is considered as dynamic, so we have actually to quantize space-time properly in order to achieve a compatible union between quantum physics and general relativity. This is indeed very difficult to achieve, attempts have been made like loop quantum gravity and string theory, but both theories are still in phase of development and are generally not completely accepted by the whole physics community.

It has to be said, QFT can be formulated on a curved background, but in this case as the wording tells you, there is no interaction of the curved spacetime with the other quantum fields. So actually, even an observer perspective from accelerated reference system can be taken, but it is only an incomplete picture of the whole because the dynamics of space-time is not taken into account.

  • I have thought that GR is a theory of spacetime as manifold and QM a theory of matter or matter fields. In this view quantized in GR can be only rulers as material objects, but not the manifold itself being non material (mathematical) object. – JanG Mar 11 '24 at 16:36
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If by "the principle of relativity" you mean "physics is the same for all inertial observers," then the answer is that quantum mechanics is fully compatible with the principle of relativity. The evidence for this statement is that there exist relativistic quantum field theories that are fully compatible with the postulates of quantum mechanics, and with Lorentz symmetry (meaning that the laws of physics are invariant under boosts of velocity, as well as rotations). The most famous and empirically tested relativistic quantum field theory is the Standard Model of particle physics. Another way to say this, is that quantum mechanics is fully compatible with special relativity. It's worth pointing out that not all quantum mechanical theories respect special relativity (such as the Hydrogen atom potential you solve in a first quantum mechanics course). Quantum mechanics is a large framework you can apply to different theories. The statement is that quantum mechanics can be applied to theories which obey special relativity.

If your question is, "why is quantum mechanics incompatible with General Relativity", then the answer is much more technical than "the principle of relativity." There are different ways of formulating the problem (perhaps also different problems). One of the most common issues you will see discussed, is that if you treat General Relativity as a quantum field theory like the Standard Model, then it is not renormalizable. There are different ways of explaining what this means in non-technical language. The way I would say it, is that if you try to treat General Relativity as a quantum field theory, then you will find that it behaves like the first term in a Taylor expansion in the energy of a process, divided by the Planck scale. This means that for energies below the Planck scale, we can trust our methods to give reliable predictions. But if we try to push GR to energies near or above the Planck scale, then we find we need access to the rest of the Taylor series, and we simply do not know what that is. The previous few sentences are meant to be a very high-level summary of the effective field theory of gravity. Of course, there are many proposed solutions to this problem and we have no idea which if any are correct. The idea of "asymptotically safe gravity" is, basically, that it is possible to construct all the missing terms of the Taylor series, using symmetry considerations. The idea of string theory is that the full theory actually involves many, many more degrees of freedom beyond those represented in the spacetime metric of general relativity, and all of these degrees of freedom have to be included to get a consistent theory.

Andrew
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There exsists relativistic quantum mechanics. For instance Klien-Gordon equation for spinless particles and also the Dirac equation for particles with spin.

SAKhan
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I think the question here really is: At what point does the relativity principle get broken? Consider classical Newtonian mechanics with strictly static external- and pair-interaction potentials. Using classical transformations to switch between inertial or accelerated frames of reference, I would expect the relativity principle to be completely valid. Now once you add electrodynamics as described by Maxwell's equation, you will run into problems when using classical transformations, because the fields transform according to Lorentz transformations. If you add gravity things will get even more complicated.

Now if you look at Quantum mechanics the situation really is quite similar. QM in its non relativistic form will be usually, for example when solving the hydrogen problem, assume static interaction potentials and ignore the dynamics of the force-fields/potentials, meaning, that all kinds of forcefields could be calculated based on the postiotion of all particles at 1 point of time, with out considereing, what happened before, and considering magnetic fields only, if they are of external origin. Now, as long as the interactions are static, I do not see, why this description would break the relativity principle at any point. If you want to describe the dynamics of the interactions you usually would want to use quantum-electrodynamics, so some kind of special relativistic QFT. In this case as far as my information goes, one will run into problems, when trying to transform into accelerated reference frames, as one does with nonquantum special-relativistic electrodynamics. I would expect these kind of field theories to only work correctly for inertial reference frames. I really have not much clue of quantum chromodynamics, but I would expect a similar Situation as for quantum electrodynamics.

So for QM with static interactions I do not see a problem with the relativity principle. For relativistic QFT I would phrase the Situation in the way, that it only works correctly in inertial frames. For Quantum Gravity, well that’s really above my wage class, but if there was a working theory I would very much expect it to work in all reference frames.

Zaph
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(I'm writing a partial answer to illustrate the kind of answer I'm looking for, although I don't actually know what the answer is. This answer is based on what I figured out after thinking about the question for a bit.)

The principle of relativity states that the laws of physics appear the same to all observers. Note this is, in theory, independent of both special relativity and general relativity; it's not even mathematical.

To make it mathematical, then we need to define what "all observers" means. The first one everyone encounters is the so-called Galilean transformation, which in 1D looks like:

$$x' = x - vt$$ $$t' = t$$

The Galilean transformation is not a physical law; it simply illustrates what we mean by "all observers". We have the $x, t$ coordinates, while the other observer has the $x', t'$ coordinates.

The problem is, of course, under the Galilean transformation, then Maxwell's equations do not remain the same for all observers (i.e., the principle of relativity is violated). Now one could say "therefore Maxwell's equations are wrong", "therefore the principle of relativity is false", or "therefore the Galilean transformation is wrong". The last option is based on the belief that the principle of relativity should hold anyway (I believe historically this was the motivation behind the Lorentz transformations, and the Lorentz transformations were derived before Einstein formulated SR). Experiment would later show that the Galilean transformation is incorrect, and the correct formulation is the Lorentz transformation:

$$x' = \gamma(x - vt)$$ $$t' = \gamma(t - vx/c^2)$$

If you take this to mean "all observers", then Maxwell's equations work.

Now let's consider how this works for quantum mechanics. The most elementary quantum equation is the Schrodinger equation:

$$i\hbar\frac{\partial}{\partial t} \Psi(x,t) = \left [ - \frac{\hbar^2}{2m}\frac{\partial^2}{\partial x^2} + V(x,t)\right ] \Psi(x,t)$$

If we substitute the Galilean transformation into this, we find that this equation remains the same ($\partial^2/\partial x^2 = \partial^2/\partial x'^2$ under the Galilean transformation). Therefore the Schrodinger equation respects the principle of relativity, if you equate the principle of relativity with the Galilean transformation. However we have reason to believe that the Lorentz transformation is the correct transform. Under the Lorentz transform, the Schrodinger equation does not remain the same for all observers.* We can therefore conclude that the Schrodinger equation does not respect the principle of relativity, if we equate the principle of relativity with the Lorentz transformation.

Once again we have several options:

  • Perhaps the principle of relativity is false.
  • Perhaps the Lorentz transformations is wrong.
  • Perhaps the Schrodinger equation needs to be modified.

As far as I'm aware, physicists have generally taken the third option, leading to the Klein-Gorden equation. (One could reasonably attempt to find some other transformation that reduces to the Lorentz transformation in some limit, and also preserves the Schrodinger equation, but for some reason [what?] this is not done). This preserves the principle of relativity, which most people seem to assume must be true. In other words, in standard physics, quantum mechanics respects the principle of relativity.

(Unfortunately I have no idea how this works in GR, so I must end the answer here.)


*This should be obvious - in the Lorentz transform, both $\gamma$ and $v$ include $x$, so the partial derivative does not remain the same either.

Allure
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The incompatibility stems from the fact that classical GR deals with gravitational fields that are continuous by nature. Quantum fields, on the other hand, are discrete. They are quantized.

Forces in Quantum Field Theory are mediated by a quanta. It was hypothesized that gravitational force is mediated by gravitons but apparently, this is very difficult to detect, if not impossible.

I also want to add that in classical GR, gravity is a fictitious force. We can always choose a reference frame in such a way that removes gravity.

These are just surface-level complications. Mathematical incompatibilities arise more clearly if we dig deep enough.

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GR describes the evolution of physical quantities in terms of classical fields all of which have a single value when measured. Quantum theory that isn't modified by collapse describes the evolution of physical quantities in terms of observables that don't just have a single value and evolve in a fixed background spacetime.

In general a quantum system's motion can't be explained by a system having a single position, e.g. - in an interference experiment the outcome depends on what happens on all of the paths the system can go down as explained in Section 2 of:

https://arxiv.org/abs/math/9911150

So then there is a problem about what the gravitational field looks like during an interference experiment, as pointed out by Feynman in various thought experiments:

https://arxiv.org/abs/2111.00337

If there is a single background spacetime then it is unclear what the gravitational field looks like in an interference experiment because the system's evolution can't be understood in terms of it being at a single location. If there isn't a single background spacetime, then we need a new theory that uses quantum observables instead of classical fields and doesn't require a fixed background spacetime, which is different from both GR and quantum theory.

Another way of proceeding would be to modify quantum theory so that for large enough objects physical quantities are single valued, e.g. -spontaneous collapse theories:

https://arxiv.org/abs/2310.14969

but such theories can't currently reproduce results of quantum field theory

https://arxiv.org/abs/2205.00568

alanf
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