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I am trying to understand the meaning 3a of "ja" in Duden:

drückt im Aussagesatz eine resümierende Feststellung aus, weist auf etwas Bekanntes hin oder dient der Begründung für ein nicht explizites Geschehen oder für etwas Allgemeingültiges; doch, bekanntlich

My questions about this:

  • I do not understand how "summarized statement" , "justification for a non-explicit event" and "points to something known/universally valid" are related. It seems to me they are totally different meanings grouped in one big definition. Could someone explain it better?

  • The only meaning I think I can partly understand is "points to something known/universally valid". Would that add a "as you know" / "as everybody knows" to the sentence? Anyway, these are very distinct meanings. How do I know which of both is meant in a sentence?

The corresponding Duden examples are:

  • ich komme ja schon
  • das habe ich ja gewusst
  • du kennst ihn ja
  • sie kommt ja immer zu spät
  • er kann sichs ja leisten

I'd appreciate if you could explain the meaning of "ja" in each of them.

Alan Evangelista
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2 Answers2

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You are correct. Learning the use of modal particles from rules is frustrating. They are pretty synthetic. I don't think any German speaker use particles based on such rules. It's all about the right feeling for the mood.

Ich komme schon. — I'm on my way.

Ich komme ja schon. — It may be a surprise to you but I'm on my way.

Das habe ich gewusst. — I knew it.

Das habe ich ja gewusst. — It didn't come to me as a surprise as I knew it.

Du kennst ihn. – You know him.

Du kennst ihn ja. – It's no surprise to you as you know him.

Sie kommt immer zu spät. — She's always late.

Sie kommt ja immer zu spät. — In case you wonder, she's always late.

Er kann sich's leisten. — He can spend that much.

Er kann sich's ja leisten. — In case you wonder, he can spend that much.

The common topic in all these examples is the surprise about a fact, or the lack thereof. To make it even worse, the particle can mean both the phrases I tried to translate or the opposite, depending on the common knowledge the speaker and the listener share about the facts talked about.

I recommend to remember the particle ja as a smoke screen. Whether you are surprised depends on whether you belong to the spectators or the troupe.

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Janka
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  • Either I’m misunderstanding your post, or I would feel like it’s the opposite of what you’re describing with your bold sections. »Du kennst ihn.« implies that whoever »Du« is did not know that they know »ihn«. Whereas »Du kennst ihn ja« implies that »Du« knows that they know »ihn«. Which concurs with the meaning weist auf etwas Bekanntes hin from the Duden. – Raketenolli Jun 03 '19 at 09:38
  • Why "ja" refers to the listener in almost all examples, but it refers to the speaker in "Das habe ich ja gewusst"? Couldn't it mean "That may be a surprise to you, but I already knew that" or "It is not a surprise to you that I already knew that" ? How do I pick the correct meaning? – Alan Evangelista Jun 03 '19 at 11:06
  • It can always mean both. As I wrote, the shared knowledge of speaker and listener is important to guess the meaning. That's also the reason why they are only seldom used in writing. Modal particles only sprinkle a certain mood (here: surprise) over the sentence. – Janka Jun 03 '19 at 12:19
  • @Raketenolli: I don't see how your understanding contradicts: It's no surprise to you as you know him. – Janka Jun 03 '19 at 12:21
  • You were clear in your answer that "ja" in a sentence indicates surprise or lack of surprise depending on the knowledge of speaker/listener. You have not explicitly explained that the person to whom "ja" refers to may also vary depending on that knowledge. Now it is clear to me, although it seems tricky to usefully communicate with such an ambiguous particle. Thanks! – Alan Evangelista Jun 03 '19 at 22:30
  • One last question: What "in case you wonder" in the last 2 translations have to do with surprise or lack of surprise? Is that an alternative additional meaning? – Alan Evangelista Jun 03 '19 at 22:37
  • In case it comes as a surprise to you, … – Janka Jun 03 '19 at 22:59
  • Thanks for the explanation! That translation is confusing because "In case you wonder" usually means "in case you are asking yourself", not "in case it comes as a surprise to you". In order to be didactic, I recommend avoiding synonyms and using the same translation whenever possible when explaining a word. – Alan Evangelista Jun 04 '19 at 08:56
  • Of cause it depends on tone, but in the first example I would rather assume a situation of someone impatiently calling for the 3rd time, and the answer Ich komme ja* schon* is more like [calm down,] I'm already on my way – Volker Landgraf Jun 06 '19 at 07:42
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    The subtext for 'Ich komme ja schon' usually is in this case more like: Don't be so impatient. I'm already on my way - and not one of surprise, rather annoyance or emphasis. – planetmaker Dec 14 '21 at 13:31
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Es gibt eine weitere Möglichkeit - "ja" erläutert mit einer Steigerung. Wenn wir eins der obigen Beispiele variieren: sie kommt ja immer zu spät > Sie kommt meistens, ja (fast) immer zu spät. Hier könnte statt "ja" verwendet werden etwa: "sogar", "genaugenommen", "zugespitzt gesagt"...

Tevfik Turan
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